TBPN · Oct 6, 2026 · 22m · 12m saved
With Greg Fleming, CEO of Rockefeller Capital Management
Apple became the first trillion-dollar company in 2018 or 2019, as Greg Fleming recalled it, and there are now 15 or 16.
Plenty of investors who lived through the dot-com crash and the financial crisis are warning that AI is a bubble. Fleming lived through both, and he said the technology is the most revolutionary thing he has seen in his 39th year of working, even as many of the companies riding it will not justify their prices.
"But a lot of these companies are not going to get the valuations that they're being awarded now." — Greg Fleming
Greg Fleming, CEO of Rockefeller Capital Management, on TBPN, was president of Merrill Lynch during the credit crisis, ran wealth and asset management at Morgan Stanley, and in 2018 started the firm that now advises wealthy American families from more than 30 wealth centers.
The full interview is covered here so you can skip it. 22 minutes of audio, 10 minutes of reading.
Here are the 10 insights that matter.
Key Takeaways
Selling Merrill Lynch to Bank of America was the most disappointing moment of his career, though it kept the firm out of bankruptcy
Below about $10 billion, Fleming said, families are better served outsourcing than building a family office; up to a couple of billion is Rockefeller's sweet spot
Nearly every family Rockefeller works with wants a philanthropy plan, including young people with new AI wealth
AI is the most revolutionary technology he has seen in his 39-year career, but there will be winners and losers
The US fiscal debt is the canary he would watch
Many AI-era companies will not get the valuations they are being awarded now
Rockefeller puts only a portion of each family's capital into speculative deals
He prefers managers who have seen something go wrong, not only one good cycle
Agents will take over advisers' meeting prep, but the client relationship stays human
1. From Merrill to Rockefeller
The hosts asked Fleming, on his first appearance, to describe his background.
He started as a management consultant at Booz Allen Hamilton in the late 1980s, then moved to Merrill Lynch as an investment banker focused on financial services. He was the lead banker on BlackRock's 1999 initial public offering, priced at $14 a share.
"So it's done quite well since then. And I actually just rejoined the board for the second time last year." — Greg Fleming
He called the sale of Merrill Lynch to Bank of America the low point of his career
"I was the president of Merrill Lynch during the credit crisis, and I negotiated the sale to Bank of America, which was, and I have said this before publicly, the most disappointing moment in my career." — Greg Fleming
"I was happy to keep the company out of bankruptcy, but it never should have had to be sold, and having to sell it was very difficult." — Greg Fleming
After that, Fleming ran wealth and asset management at Morgan Stanley, left in 2016, and partnered with the Rockefeller family office, founded by John D. Rockefeller in 1882.
"His wealth, by the way, gentlemen, at one time was 4% of GDP." — Greg Fleming
Viking Global Investors backed the new firm, which started on March 1, 2018, to give high-net-worth and ultra-high-net-worth families comprehensive advice.
